Let the insanity begin, maybe: Proposed cycle

[metalcavy87]

Not a new face around here, but it's been a while. Hope everyone's doing well.

Just to preface, a couple of months ago I posted something here proposing a conservative third cycle, but ultimately, I think I've changed my mind and would like to try something a bit more... radical. Here's what I was thinking: a bulking cycle consisting of the following.

VITAL INFO:

Duration: 12 weeks (in other words ten weeks plus the two weeks the various long esters will remain in my system after cessation of injection)
Lifting experience: ~5 years
Completed cycles, fully recovered: 2
Goal: 20-30lbs of solid mass, strength increases are great too though
Starting weight: 205lbs
Height: 5'10"
Age: Irrelevant, I've done my homework and know all of the risks involved and how to minimize or eliminate them entirely.
Calories: ~4000-5000/day


COMPONENTS:

Organon Sustanon 750mg/wk (split into 250mg 3x weekly doses)
**Base, included for its obvious benefits w/ regard to bulking. I know it's a high dose, but I have to break open an amp for each 250mg dose, so taking fractions of a mL is not really an option.

Homebrewed Tri-Trenabol 75mg-150mg/wk depending on sides (split into 25mg - 50mg doses 3x weekly doses) <---used ethyl oleate (EO) in the mixture, great stuff
**Failing Tri-Trenabol, Trenbolone Enanthate. I will adjust the dosage depending on the sides, will prob start off at 75mg and taper up if necessary.

Homebrewed Equipose 600mg/wk (split into 200mg 3x weekly doses)
**Because Sustanon hurts like a bitch and I want to cut it with something useful, and appetite increase. Can't forget the (comparatively) moderate anabolic benefits either. If money was no object I'd use primobolan instead.

HCG 250IU 2x/week
**Not gonna stop testicular atrophy or prevent HPTA shutdown, but usually helps to slow it a little

Arimidex ~.5mg/day
**To minimize water retention, low dose b/c sustanon usually is not too bad in that regard.
***Do you all think I may need bromocriptine/cabergoline as well? From what I understand, progesterone usually only becomes problematic in the absense of testosterone... so I would assume not. Please correct me if I'm wrong though.


PLANNED PCT (4 weeks):

Egis Clomid, (tapering 150/100/50/50)
Rx Toremifene (120/120/60/60)


OTHER THINGS:
Multivitamin (Animal Stak)
Melanotan II
Creatine Ethyl Ester




As an aside, I have 200 10mg oral-turinabols and 200 10mg anavars sittin around too. I was considering throwing them in too but I'm hesitant because I feel that would be way too many compounds at once. Plus, a lot of the benefits overlap: anavar is notably for strength gain, but trenbolone much more so. Anyone disagree and think I should include these mild orals? I have some synthergine on hand anyways so it wouldn't be out of the question.

Any feedback/suggestions/improvements? Love it? Hate it? Think I'm batshit insane (you wouldn't be the only one)?

Thanks guys.

[ronnie]

Looks like a good cycle.i would up the tren to 300mg week.get some caber just in case.

[zznwhs]

My first thoughts.....WAY too much gear. You are just wasting money if you run this much at this point since your receptors are fresh and you will probably respond well to lower doses. I would do either the tren or EQ...not both. I would go with tren enanthate if you decide to go with tren, and start at about 200mg/week to see how you react to it. Skip the orals, use them for another cycle.

[SteroidalTendency]

you wont see anything too spectacular form 10 weeks of EQ.

[jchh]

I would drop the Tren or if your dead set use Acetate for a couple weeks to see how you will react to it, some people just cant tolerate it(Im assuming youve never ran tren before).
750 is on the high side as you are aware,IMO unesecarily high for a 3rd cycle keep in mind muscle building is a marathon not a sprint.
Love the EQ but I think you will benefit more from at least a 12 week run of it.
You are right about the test with regards to progesterone, but you should still absolutley have bromo or caber on hand just in case. If you decide to run the tren.

Sorry to kinda shit on your cycle, it seems as though youve done your homework and are well informed, This is definetly a solid cycle for down the road, just too much for a 3rd cycle IMO.
Heres what I would do:
Weeks 1-16 250-500mg Sust
Weeks 1-14 600mg EQ
If you decide on Tren I would use Ace in either the first 6 weeks to jumpstart the cycle or in weeks 12-18 to finish off.

[mccollumstacy]

Opinion Only here:

I would extend the cycle out to at least 16 weeks - maybe 18.

drop the Sust back to 500 or less

Run the Eq for the first 10-12 weeks (depending on whether you go 16 / 18)
Pick the Tren up (low dose) as a load in week 8 - and go full dose by wk 11

To comment on the prog. from the tren - it is my understanding that the higher the test dose - the more probable the prog. sides from the tren. This has been a hot topic lately here and over at PM. Lots of guys (myself included) are going w/ low test cycles while keeping the anabolics high.

[zznwhs]

Opinion Only here:

I would extend the cycle out to at least 16 weeks - maybe 18.

drop the Sust back to 500 or less

Run the Eq for the first 10-12 weeks (depending on whether you go 16 / 18)
Pick the Tren up (low dose) as a load in week 8 - and go full dose by wk 11

To comment on the prog. from the tren - it is my understanding that the higher the test dose - the more probable the prog. sides from the tren. This has been a hot topic lately here and over at PM. Lots of guys (myself included) are going w/ low test cycles while keeping the anabolics high.

Bump this. sounds like a good plan.

[Hockey265]

Opinion Only here:

I would extend the cycle out to at least 16 weeks - maybe 18.

drop the Sust back to 500 or less

Run the Eq for the first 10-12 weeks (depending on whether you go 16 / 18)
Pick the Tren up (low dose) as a load in week 8 - and go full dose by wk 11

To comment on the prog. from the tren - it is my understanding that the higher the test dose - the more probable the prog. sides from the tren. This has been a hot topic lately here and over at PM. Lots of guys (myself included) are going w/ low test cycles while keeping the anabolics high.
Bump again. I think you'd be sitting pretty with something like this.

[tdizzle28]

You're going to have to change "call signs" from "Metalcavy87" to "SwoleBostonkid" :)
Assuming there is no copyright infringement from Swoletexaskid! :D:D

[lola26]

bump mc

[jjgonz]

bump mc again

[drob29]

metalcavy what were your first two cycles? Also age is not irrelevant, although as I recall your about 20, correct?

[IronBod]

More is Better, We all know that. yeah right. :D:D:D

Just go read Swoles thread, if you beleive that. Come on bro, this is
only your 3rd cycle, and you already feel like you need Tren ?

[metalcavy87]

Thanks for the input guys. I really do appreciate it. I'm leaning towards taking Mccollumstacy's advice; it makes good sense. Also, it turns out that he is correct, the relationship b/t progesterone and testosterone is something of a direct correlation; as testosterone rises, so do the progesteronic side-effects. (In truth there's a little more to it than that but for our purposes this explanation will suffice)

If I decide to drop the Tren, which is a possibility, I'll prob stick with my original planned cycle - which was basically Sustanon/Equipose/Anavar. But we'll see, perhaps extending it to 14 weeks as jchh suggested.

To answer Drob's question, which was what exactly constituted my first two cycles:

1st cycle, very basic:
500mg Aburaihan test enanthate/wk for 10 weeks (250mg 2x weekly)
Standard PCT

2nd cycle:
500mg Galenika test enanthate/wk wks 1-10 (250mg 2x weekly)
300mg homebrewed test proprionate/wk wks 8-12 (100mg EOD)
400mg Balkan Primobolan/wk wks 4-10 (I treated myself b/c I won $500 in Alin's December contest, figured why not/ 200mg 2x week on enanthate, ~133mg EOD when I picked up the prop)
60mg oral-turinabol/day wk 1-8 (yes, I know tbol is 17-alpha alkylated, but two weeks more then usual didnt rip up my liver)
PCT w/ clomid & toremifene

And yeah, Drob, you are correct about the age.

More is Better, We all know that. yeah right.

Just go read Swoles thread, if you beleive that. Come on bro, this is
only your 3rd cycle, and you already feel like you need Tren ?

In response to this gem of a comment: I never suggested that more was better. So I'll spare IronBod the burden of thinking and break it down step by step.


1)In the course of these two cycles I have discovered that having about 700mg of test active in my system is my magic #

2) As organon sustanon comes in 250mg amps, splitting the dose is not really an option. Plus, EOD dosing generally works better with multi-estered testosterones, in order to maintain a more stable blood level.

3) That statement is absolutely ridiculous if the poster even bothered to read my post; why the fuck would I be proposing tapering UP on trenbolone if I was being reckless w/ regards to dosage? Further, I never stated I NEEDED tren, simply that it would be complementary to my goals. But you know what? Not a fucking person on this planet NEEDS trenbolone. That kind of bullshit reeks of unwarranted, unsubstantiated elitism; just because it's a powerful substance does not mean it is not useable by anyone other than self-proclaimed "Gurus". And there's frankly nothing I despise more. So shove it.

4) 600mg doses of Equipose are quite common, and are from what I understand, pretty average. 150mg/wk of trenbolone is very conservative. 750mg of test/wk is above average, but not within the realm of reckless stupidity.

5) What's more, if you read my post history, you'll find I'm hardly an idiot who rushes into things without thinking them through first. There is a method to my madness, and there are reasons I chose the substances I did at the dosages I did, above and beyond the ones I've listed. I'm not dumb. In fact, with trenbolone in particular, I selected it BECAUSE of its extreme androgenic and anabolic properties and because of my age; I am certainly not approaching this blindly. There are some very particular effects I'm seeking besides just weight gain, and the most efficient vehicle to achieve this would be with a powerful androgen/anabolic.. But that's all I'm gonna say.

So go suck a dick "bro".

EVERYONE ELSE: THANK YOU for the input.

[The BB Monad]

Opinion Only here:

I would extend the cycle out to at least 16 weeks - maybe 18.

drop the Sust back to 500 or less

Run the Eq for the first 10-12 weeks (depending on whether you go 16 / 18)
Pick the Tren up (low dose) as a load in week 8 - and go full dose by wk 11

To comment on the prog. from the tren - it is my understanding that the higher the test dose - the more probable the prog. sides from the tren. This has been a hot topic lately here and over at PM. Lots of guys (myself included) are going w/ low test cycles while keeping the anabolics high.

And definately BUMP once again!

[drob29]

So go suck a dick "bro".

100% uncalled for. Listen metal, you need to show respect. Even if Ironbod was not a respected senior member your still way out of line, and the fact he is makes it even worse.

I may not agree with how his comment was worded, and quite frankly I thought his input in the 1/2 life thread was not helpful. But I can be honest and say that, because the other 98% of what I have heard him say in the past two years I have been here has been spot on and he has helped me with his knowledge. Hopefully he respects my opinion here 95% of the time. If he thinks I'm as ass the other 5%, whatever..

regardless, IMO you come across as an overeducated elitist twit who thinks they know more than they do. Understand your very young to be doing AAS anyway. You get help here from alot of people with different backgrounds and ways of expressing themselves. Listen to what people say and most of the time you'll hear something you can use. Life is like that. You may not always hear what you want or how you want to hear it.

like I said, your way out of line on this one metal.

[deepblue]

100% uncalled for. Listen metal, you need to show respect. Even if Ironbod was not a respected senior member your still way out of line, and the fact he is makes it even worse.

I may not agree with how his comment was worded, and quite frankly I thought his input in the 1/2 life thread was not helpful. But I can be honest and say that, because the other 98% of what I have heard him say in the past two years I have been here has been spot on and he has helped me with his knowledge. Hopefully he respects my opinion here 95% of the time. If he thinks I'm as ass the other 5%, whatever..

regardless, IMO you come across as an overeducated elitist twit who thinks they know more than they do. Understand your very young to be doing AAS anyway. You get help here from alot of people with different backgrounds and ways of expressing themselves. Listen to what people say and most of the time you'll hear something you can use. Life is like that. You may not always hear what you want or how you want to hear it.

like I said, your way out of line on this one metal.I agree with drob,you asked for the opinions,so no need to act that way cub.:mad:That really shows your age!:mad:

[IronBod]

No comment !

[Outtlaw]

COMPONENTS:

Organon Sustanon 750mg/wk (split into 250mg 3x weekly doses)

Homebrewed Tri-Trenabol 75mg-150mg/wk depending on sides

Homebrewed Equipose 600mg/wk

HCG 250IU 2x/week

Arimidex ~.5mg/day

I don't like it. 1st, it wouldn't be my choice to run a tren/EQ combo (there are better choices IMO), and I don't see the point of running such a low dose of tren anyways. It's like you're just throwing it in there for the hell of it. I'd drop the tren and just up the EQ dose to 800/wk (1g if you feel you need that much gear). And I'd probably drop the sust down to 500mg/wk.

[metalcavy87]

like I said, your way out of line on this one metal.

You're right, the comment was outta line. I see that now, but all I was seeing was red yesterday.

IronBod: Sorry man. I was in a terrible mood yesterday. Not your fault and it was wrong of me to take it out on you. No excuses, just the truth. I will control myself next time. Consider this a formal apology, but it's totally your call whether you accept it or not.

[deepblue]

Hey man none of my buis but that was cool metalcav.

[lunny]

Multivitamin (Animal Stak)
Melanotan II
Creatine Ethyl Ester




Metal how you liking the melanotan?????

[metalcavy87]

Metal how you liking the melanotan?????

It's still awesome lunny. Good stuff. Haven't gotten too much in the way of sun exposure but I'm still a great deal darker than almost everyone else I know.

[lunny]

It's still awesome lunny. Good stuff. Haven't gotten too much in the way of sun exposure but I'm still a great deal darker than almost everyone else I know.

Cool im thinkin i might try the stuff... how is it on the appetite?

[metalcavy87]

Cool im thinkin i might try the stuff... how is it on the appetite?

At first the nausea would kill my appetite, but the side effects go away over time, and if you want to avoid them entirely, just take an anti-histamine like zyrtec (think it's available OTC now, if you wanna save money just look for generic centirizine hydrochloride) or benadryl about 30 mins before the shot. No problem.

[lunny]

At first the nausea would kill my appetite, but the side effects go away over time, and if you want to avoid them entirely, just take an anti-histamine like zyrtec (think it's available OTC now, if you wanna save money just look for generic centirizine hydrochloride) or benadryl about 30 mins before the shot. No problem.

Cool bud thanks im for sure going to run it now. So what dose are you running it at and how many days a week????

[High9]

Opinion Only here:

I would extend the cycle out to at least 16 weeks - maybe 18.

drop the Sust back to 500 or less

Run the Eq for the first 10-12 weeks (depending on whether you go 16 / 18)
Pick the Tren up (low dose) as a load in week 8 - and go full dose by wk 11

To comment on the prog. from the tren - it is my understanding that the higher the test dose - the more probable the prog. sides from the tren. This has been a hot topic lately here and over at PM. Lots of guys (myself included) are going w/ low test cycles while keeping the anabolics high.

Metal, the current feeling is that high-dose AAS is tolerated better when you have either high anabolics with low androgens, or high androgens with low anabolics. Everyone will have different tolerances but this is trend that is working for a lot of people in designing cycles for their goals.

[metalcavy87]

Cool bud thanks im for sure going to run it now. So what dose are you running it at and how many days a week????

I usually do 1mg/wk, which is one shot per week, on Sunday. I'm just maintaining the color I put on. I figure when summer hits, I don't really wanna change races, y'know? Haha.

[lunny]

I usually do 1mg/wk, which is one shot per week, on Sunday. I'm just maintaining the color I put on. I figure when summer hits, I don't really wanna change races, y'know? Haha.

LOL..... hear that.

[soldierb11]

personally I would just order the gear from alin, i wouldnt want the hassle of homebrewing anything.
but good luck with the cycle